TAS 497 (HOT SEAT) Is MY Product Too Competitive? Please help!!

It’s time for another exciting Hot Seat Session with Scott and Chris! This is where you get to hear the guys break down the data and product listing from one of their Private Label Classroom students who is looking for input to get their business to the next level of growth. If you find yourself stuck and struggling to find the right piece to make your brand take off, this is an episode you want to pay attention to. What are you waiting for? Have pen and paper ready for this informative episode of The Amazing Seller!

Product research is a vital step!

If you’ve been around the TAS community for very long, you know that Scott stresses the importance of taking your time in the product research phase. On this episode of The Amazing Seller, you’ll hear from Scott and Chris as they explain how the product research step impacts your brand. It may sound complex but the guys do a great job unpacking and explaining product validation. Don’t make mistakes you can easily avoid! Take the time to learn from Scott and Chris’ expert advice including the 10x10x1 strategy so you can get your ecommerce brand up and running.

Get in the right mindset for success.

If you have any hope for long-term profitability for your ecommerce business, you’ve got to be willing to take a few hits along the way. Don’t expect to start raking in profits right of the batt, be prepared to weather the storm of getting a brand up and running. You’ll have a great chance for success if you adopt the mindset of seeing this a multistage process. To a good grasp what you should expect, listen to this episode of The Amazing Seller as Scott and Chris take their time to educate sellers like you on long-term brand success. You don’t want to miss it!

Why it’s important to pay attention to the competition.

Do you have a good idea of what your biggest competitor’s business looks like? Have you poured over their numbers and sketched out a map of their apparent strategy in the marketplace? How would you rank your product and product listing compared to theirs? Would you buy your product over theirs? On this episode of The Amazing Seller, Scott and Chris share why it’s so important to understand your competition in the product space you are hoping to make an impact in. If you’ve missed this important step, it’s not too late! Listen to this episode and get the information you need get headed in the right direction.

How product variations can make your product stand out.

As an ecommerce business leader, you want to do everything you can to make your product stand out and succeed. From featuring sharp, high-quality pictures to cleaning up the content of your product listing, chances are you’ve done a lot to attract buyers and get them to purchase your product. But have you taken it one step further by offering attractive product variations? On this episode of The Amazing Seller, Scott and Chris explain how offering the right product variations can make your product more appealing than the competitions and give you insight into what the market demands are for your product. Hear more about this important topic on this episode!

OUTLINE OF THIS EPISODE OF THE AMAZING SELLER

  • [0:03] Scott’s introduction to this episode of the podcast!
  • [2:00] Scott and Chris jump into another Hot Seat Session.
  • [5:00] Why it’s important to be thorough during the product research phase.
  • [6:30] Red flags that Scott sees for this particular product listing.
  • [9:00] Make sure you are in the right mindset for your product to succeed.
  • [11:00] The guys break down the numbers for the product listing.
  • [13:30] Taking a look at the competition.
  • [18:00] Why depth in the product market is something to pay attention to.
  • [22:00] Variations can make or break a product.
  • [24:00] Chris shares his advice for the seller.
  • [26:30] Scott talks about product discovery and his advice for the seller.
  • [29:00] Why the product has good potential but not the best option for a first product.
  • [34:00] Closing thoughts from the guys.

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TRANSCRIPT TAS 497

TAS 497: (HOT SEAT) Is MY Product Too Competitive? Please help!!

[INTRODUCTION]

[00:00:03] Scott: Well hey, hey what’s up everyone! Welcome back to another episode of The Amazing Seller Podcast. This is episode number 497 and today I've got…

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…my good friend back on Chris Shaffer because we're going to dive into another hot seat session and the title of this one is the exact title or subject line that came into my email inbox, “Is this product too competitive? Please help.” So that's what we're going to be talking about today Chris. You're ready?

[00:00:32] Chris: Yes. That's both the answer to the question ‘Am I ready?' and the answer to the question. It was nice talking to you, this was a great hot seat. Let's actually dive in and take a look and Scott I'm ready to rock if you are. I have that email from Quan pulled up and if you want me to read through that and let everybody know the juicy details of what we're going to be diving into, I can do that for you.

[00:00:55] Scott: I do, as soon as I let people know how to get the show notes and the transcripts, just in case I forget to. I want to get that out there just so everyone knows that they can go over to theamazaingseller.com/497 and you can grab the show notes, the transcripts, all the links that we talk about here in this hot seat session and that way there if you wanted to go read it, you could. I know a lot of people sometimes Chris they tell me the like the show notes and transcripts because while they are at work, which they are trying to get out of, they can get out of read without their boss seeing or hearing them do what they are doing.

Let's go on. There's always a solution to a problem. Let's go ahead and read that email from Quan. It's Quan, right?

[00:01:43] Chris: I believe so. If we're butchering your name, we apologize in advance. Or I guess it's not in advance because we've already butchered it like six times but that's not important. Scott the other thing I want to say is 497. Wow. How did that happen? That's what I'd like to know. I guess three times a week for the last two and a half years will do that.

[00:02:03] Scott: Well, sometimes I can stay on track with my workout routines like three times a week, a lot of times it's four or five times but sometimes I fall off the wagon and it takes me a little while to get back but I have to say for the past three years it's been consistently Monday, Wednesday, Friday here on the podcast. Maybe what I should do is make sure that every Monday, Wednesday and Friday I definitely work out for those days too. Maybe that's part of that process. I don't know. I'll figure it out.

[00:02:29] Chris: You don't listen to your podcast while you work out? That's like a really easy cue Scott. You can listen to yourself talk and then…

[00:02:38] Scott: Let's go ahead. Let's dig into hot seat.

[00:02:41] Chris: We got an email here from Quan and Scott like you said it says, “Is this product too competitive? Please help.” And he says, “My name is Quan. I'm from Seattle Washington. First I just wanted to say thank you because honestly you've been inspirational for me on this Amazon journey. Definitely would not know what I know if it weren't for you. I have a question about my product. Right now I've invested in a product and I'm having trouble getting organic sales. I'm ranking in and out of page one. Initially the way I thought I was going to run traffic to my product was to through aggressive PPC, maybe some Facebook ads, some infomercials with a 40% discount offer.

Unfortunately it wasn't getting me enough sales a day to get me ranked. I did not have a big enough email list to do the email launch that you guys talk about. On top of that, PPC for this keyword is extremely expensive. $3-$5  a click because of this I decided not to do a giveaway in addition to Facebook and Instagram traffic. The giveaway was enough for me to get ranked the middle bottom of page one.” We'll just call that the bottom of page one. “Now, the problem is I'm not seeing any organic sales. I've been doing a giveaway since the 10th of February and I don't seem to be getting any traction when it comes to organic sales. Now, it just feels like I'm giving away product and going to lose money all together. Is there a period of time before you start to see organic sales? Is this product just too competitive?

I see hundreds of pages of products and lots of them have under 20 reviews. Is this a bad sign? Should I just liquidate and move on to a new product? Right now I have about 180 units left and I want to stop the bleeding if I can. Any advice? Quan.” So Scott I think we have a good chunk of advice for him just based on our initial look. Do you want to just dive right into it?

[00:04:20] Scott: I think one of the biggest issues is number one when you did your product research and you're looking at the market that you're going to go into, were you looking at what it was going to take to rank? Because a lot of times Chris people don't, and Quan I'm not like just picking on you. This is normal. We've seen a lot. And you're going to learn from it. But I'm not going to sit here and say the product is not going to work for you either. I think it could and I'll talk about why but I'll just want to say like in the beginning part of this like you almost need to know when you launch you need 15 or 20 sales per day for 14 days/10 days, whatever it is.

Because everyone else has that in the depth and demand we've looked at already before we went into this market. The other thing is I would also be thinking to myself that that's the case, well then I have to figure out how am I going to get those sales. You can't just turn on pay-per-click and it's going to be all the sales that you need. In a perfect world that would be amazing. That would be easy. We just pay some money and we get it done. The other option is building your own email list or going out there and finding other influencers in your space that can help you or just a group up there that would be able to purchase your product at a discount.

Now, Chris I did a little bit of digging here while you were reading that as well because there was something else I was wondering as far as like what other products could be purchased alongside this product just because I wanted to know so I could say like okay maybe you got to start thinking about the second, third product that can be related to this. But what I noticed straight away and this is another thing for people to look at even when you're looking at competitors so here is a big, big tip here for you guys. I scroll down on Quan's listing and I look at customers who bought this item also bought this. Now if you are going into a market and you see that people are doing these giveaways in these giveaway groups, that's a little bit of a red flag for me as well because now I'm saying, oh wait a minute here, I'm going to be competing with someone that's giving away their product at a huge discount or maybe for free in order to get ranked.

[00:06:31] Scott: That's what I'm competing against, that's who I'm playing alongside and I might not want to do that. That might have been one red flag that you would have seen. I'm seeing that on your listing itself, I can see that people bought things not even related to your product. So big tip here. If you go to one of the listings that you are looking to sell or one of your competitors and you scroll down, you're like oh their sales look amazing. They've got 1,500 sales a month and they've been selling for three months. Then you scroll down and you don't see related products but you see like a garlic press that you sell and then let's say you see a dog leash. They don't go together.

The chances of that being something that Amazon is going to recommend unless the people that were in that review group or that, we'll call it a deal site that is an older review group that's now converted to a deal site but if that's the case you know that that competition is doing those types of things. So I just want to throw that out there. That's another thing when you're doing your research that you want to look for because that's a red flag to me and if you see that there's three or four different competitors that have really good sales but that is the case too, all… If they don't have their own frequently bought together type of results right now at this point, then I wouldn't use their numbers to base my decision on.

Does that make sense Chris?

[00:07:51] Chris: It does. And that I think is important thing and it's kind of an extra step Scott just if you're seeing some of the numbers here that you see for Quan you may want to take. There's a lot of demand on the market. It's definitely something to work out or if there's newer sellers coming on the scene make sure that they are not doing that. That's really a step.

[00:08:11] Scott: Yeah it is and it was something that I just randomly did here while you were going through that. The other thing that I'm going to be talking about here and Chris we can dig in, I mean the first thing that I'm noticing is number one you are at the highest price point in your market or in your product as far as competition. Everyone else is selling for $20, you're selling for $30. That right there already is going to be harder especially when you don't have the sales velocity to begin with. Now I looked back at your history, I can do that in Jungle Scout, I looked at your history and it looks like you launched at around like $30 and then you went down to like $23 and then from there you went back up to $27.

I think you've been sticking at the $27. When a lot of people launch they don't realize that that first batch of product that you ordered, the second batch even is really there to just get the sales to get yourself rooted and get yourself to where you're starting to get rankings but if you're just sitting there thinking to yourself, “But I paid $12 for this product, there is no way I could sell it for $20 you already to me not thinking along the lines of I'm in promotion phase here.' I'm in promotion phase to get my product so I can get sales, sales that aren't through deal sites by the way either so this way here I can start to get that organic ranking and then I can start to slowly bring that price up.

The market does say that it will, from what I'm gathering and Chris I don't know, correct me if I'm wrong it is telling me that you could get upwards of $22 to $30 depending. But for most part, the ones that I'm looking at are the sweet spots probably between $23 and $25. But you're already up on the upper end of that. Again, if we're going to do pay-per-click, and again then someone is like, “I'm spending money on pay-per-click how can I even afford to do less than $27?” Because you're not going to be doing this to make money, this first round. Maybe even second round. Does that make sense Chris?

[00:10:16] Chris: Yeah, and we've said this before Scott. Our goal with a product is to breakeven on the first order. Now, generally we also end up getting a profit because sales velocity takes over. But if we go into it knowing that we are trying to break even that makes it okay to run pay-per-click and come out at a break even cost. Now, if you're paying $5 a click for PPC that's a little different but something tells me that maybe you're missing something on the PPC side because there's a lot of people, some of the high end sellers, people that are selling more are running PPC. Either they are vomiting money or missing something on the PPC side that might help us out there and it might be just dialing in or using some keywords that are lower cost.

It may not be the most obvious one, it maybe be a more generic key term or keyword I guess is what I should say there. We try to break even. The biggest challenge here I think is just to crack and get into those ranks for a product like this. We need to be selling and I just ran the numbers on a slightly different variation of the keyword here Scott, 641 monthly average sales. Let's call it 21 a day, if I can do math. I'm sure somebody is yelling back at their podcast. If you're in the office listening to this and trying not to be caught by your boss, don't yell that my math is incorrect. That's a sure sign.

But you can think it loudly to yourself. But if we call it 21 that means we need to sell 21 somehow. Whether that's through discounts, whether that's through PPC, we need to figure that out. And so it's something that we have to push. I'm willing to bet that we're making a decent profit margin. Like if we were to sell this at $27?

[00:12:08] Scott: Yeah, they are trying to sell it for $27.99. The top seller right now is like $26.99.

[00:12:14] Chris: So I'm willing to bet seeing this product that we're probably making a pretty healthy profit if we were to sell it at $27. Is that an accurate statement?

[00:12:22] Scott: I would hope so. If you've done your sourcing correctly then I would say yes.

[00:12:28] Chris: This product to me maybe three or four bucks plus shipping, on the higher end.

[00:12:33] Scott: Let's even just call it five bucks.

[00:12:36] Chris: Let's say its $10 landed plus $5 in Amazon PPC. That's probably high. That would leave us $12 in margin so what can we do with that $12 in margin? Well, we can drop it to $19 to spike our sales. We can run pay-per-click and see what happens and really start to dial that in. Even $3 a click that means we would a need 25% conversion rate to be break even there. But that's doable if we find the right keywords. Obviously that's not going to happen in the first week of getting data. But it's definitely doable to narrow that down. And in narrowing that down we're also going to reduce the cost not just the number of key terms. So really to make this move, we need to get velocity behind it and we need to find out a way to do that, either profitably or worst case at a breakeven point.

[00:13:30] Scott: So let's talk about those numbers though. So from what we gathered, from what we looked at, there's one major player right now which I look they are not a major brand. To me they were the first to market in a sense it kind of looks like. And then now everyone else is trying to come in and grab some of those but they are like 3,500 sales a month and they've been selling for like I think about a year which is good so then we get some good history  on that. But there's some new players that have already come into the space which that happens. it happened to us, it's going to happen.

But I'm looking at someone right now that came into market and they are ranking on page one just under the top one and they only have 30 reviews and they are selling for $17.97. Now, they are probably doing exactly what we're saying that we would do is lower the price, run pay-per-click. I didn't look either if they are running pay-per-click. I'm going to do that while we are here on the fly right now. They are not, at least not on this page. They could be but they are not only this particular page. Let me extract this second page and see if there's anything coming up there. But from what I'm gathering right now, I am not seeing any pay-per-click being run from them. That tells me that they are probably doing which, again I'm going to do a little work here on the fly.

I'm going to click into that listing, I'm going to see frequently bought together and yes, frequently bought together, guess what, the frequently bought products are together Chris? Want to guess?

[00:15:11] Chris: No, I'd like you to tell me.

[00:15:13] Scott: It is a supplement. So this product is not a supplement and it does not lend itself to a supplement at all. So that clearly tells me they are giving away massive amounts in order to rank and they are pricing at $17.97 so they are totally losing money in order to make this work. So again, all I did was I clicked into that competition and I see exactly what their frequently bought together was. So again, that's something you got to pay attention to. They are aggressive. I'm going to go to one more Chris. Another one looks like they've been around for a little while, let me just look at the sales numbers again and sorry guys for doing this on the fly but I want to actually work through this together.

All right, so I've got another one here that's selling for $29.95, 1,400 sales per month with only 17 reviews and I'm pulling that up. They've been selling since November of 2017 and they started with about a couple hundred sales and then they didn't have sales really in January. Must have ran out of stock or something and then now they are back and they've had a 900 sales. So that's it. That's all the history they have. But here's what I want to do next. I'm going to go ahead and I am going to click on that particular one because they have a lot of sales and I'm going to click on them and I'm going to go down to ‘frequently bought together' and I'm going to do exactly what I just did with you guys.

Let's go ahead and I'm going to do this on the fly. ‘Frequently bought together', where are you. Bear with me. For this one here it's showing me sponsored, then customers who viewed this also viewed this, I'm not seeing a frequently bought together in this one which is really, really strange. Chris, why is this one not showing up?

[00:17:01] Chris: Just because you're looking for it.

[00:17:03] Scott: Yeah and I'm doing this on the fly.

[00:17:06] Chris: Was this somebody off the main. I'll see if I have it.

[00:17:10] Scott: No. Well, yes it was. But anyway, I don't want to take up more time doing this. I'll do this while you're filling in as far as what your thoughts are on the numbers. Like let's just talk about the numbers again, like you've got some pretty big numbers here. We've got some pretty big numbers where the price is decent, it's between $19.95 and $29.95 but the numbers are pretty large. We're talking 1,300, we're talking 790, we're talking 1,400/400/700/3,700/1,400/. Those are some big, big numbers. So again Chris, like you said 20 a day that can get us maybe on page one but it might even take a little bit more.

Chris if we were looking at these numbers before we went into this market, what would we be thinking?

[00:18:10] Chris: I think our biggest concern here again, not reviews related but just depth related for sure there is a ton of depth here but that can also be a double edged sword. It's something you and I talked about recently inside the class even. If we're seeing a gone of depth before seeing 1,000s of units move, that's also a sign for us that the market maybe a little competitive. Not necessarily in terms of like can't enter into that market but is something that we need to note because we do Scott like we mentioned earlier we do need to know how many sales it's going to take to rank there.

If we're seeing 900, that's 30 units a day. We need 30 units a day for usually five to ten days to really secure that ranking. So five days at 30 units a day, it's 150. At ten days it's 300. That's a lot of inventory that we need to have that we need to be able to move in the beginning and that's one of the reasons that we typically tell people to look for the ten by ten by one product. So look for something that's going to sell you 10 a day especially upfront. Now, Scott if we had a brand and a big email list, if we saw this kind of depth and this number of sales required for a product in the new brand, knowing that we have 25,000 emails and we have some capital behind it, would this scare you away?

[00:19:34] Scott: No.

[00:19:34] Chris: In the new brand.

[00:19:36] Scott: No.

[00:19:36] Chris: Would this be your first product that you watch.

[00:19:39] Scott: It probably won't be our first product but it would definitely be a product that I would launch and I would do it as soon as… Again, if I start the brand and I have this, then maybe I would think about launching it but I don't know if it would be the first product. I think would try to go after something that had a little bit less sales so I could go ahead and maybe get ten sales a day for ten or 15 days and then start to rank and then start to build that momentum. I wouldn't want to want to after something that had over 1,000 sales per month right out of the gate.

[00:20:08] Chris: And that's one of the things I think is really important to understand. The reason is we talk about that is not because we want all these sales for ourselves. It's not because these products are inherently bad. It's just if you don't have the resources in place from an email list that you can tap into to the capital that's required to keep something like this up and moving, it becomes very difficult and it becomes a drain. And so Scott one of the things you and I talk about all the time is going after those 300 unit a month products in the beginning. Because that's going to help you build up your warchest and your cash flow.

So that you can launch your product like this because even if we get to page one, if we can't keep up with the inventory we're going to get knocked out real fast by somebody who can. So that's one of the things that stands out for me. The other thing that stood out for me Scott, you were talking about that person selling at $17.97, we know for a fact that they are doing giveaways because they are showing up with what is clearly a private label supplement and I happen to know the exact service they are using because I get emails from them and I've seen that supplement in those emails.

But the other thing that was interesting for me is they are actually using influencers. I just went to Google and I typed the brand name and I see them talking about the product. They have YouTube videos and Instagram influencers that are pushing sales of that product as well. Now, I don't how many of them are coming from that, versus how many are coming for the giveaway but it looks like they are throwing everything at this product.

[00:21:37] Scott: The other thing that I noticed too Chris, I'm just doing a little bit more research while you were giving your thoughts, there's also another color that seems to be grabbing some of the share. So that could be another factor like are those numbers because they have two variations on there, are some of those numbers not for the color or style that you are selling. Could that be part of the reason? It's great question.

[00:22:08] Chris: That's one of the things that's interesting Scott. And I think they are selling at $19.95 here. They are in second position. They have two variations. Their variation that is the most similar to Quan's is not selling well. The variation that is different is the reason they are ranked number two on that page. I think you're probably looking at the same listing that I am. They are selling really well. The variation that's different is $4.20. The variation that's the same as everybody else's they are only selling 83, which to me again that speaks to this market. If you launch the same exact market as everyone else has, you're going to run to that issue.

The reason that this product is doing well is because it's different. Not everybody wants the same color. So they were able to test it, probably with a small quantity of a different color. See that it was working well and then go all in with that other color. Does that make sense?

[00:23:04] Scott: Yeah, it does. The other thing that I wanted to mention here is because I was doing a little bit more digging through like ‘frequently bought together' and stuff. If the sales are not that much. Like let's say you have 300 sales, that sounds good but if you have only been selling for a month you might not get frequently bought together. That's my thought on that. That's why I don't think I could see what that other seller was ‘frequently bought together'. That also tells me that they might not be doing giveaways, they might be using their own list, they might be using influencers, something like that.

If they were using a giveaway service of some kind or review group of any of that stuff, I would assume they would have come up in the ‘frequently bought together.' It does say ‘customers who viewed this item also viewed this' ‘customers also shopped for' but it doesn't give me ‘frequently bought together'. So again, I just want to add that in because I was going through that. So what kind of advice here for Quan would you want to give him at this stage of the game?

[00:24:09] Chris: Well, it's actually interesting Scott because most of the time when we do hot seats, we say look, your title is wrong, your images are wrong, your pricing is probably wrong. Go fix those things and then tell us what the traffic is. In this case I don't think that the listing is necessarily the issue. I think we've got the main keyword at the front of the title, the pictures are pretty good, they are definitely on par with what everybody else is doing. There's some things that we could test there but nothing that I would say is like killing them.

The biggest thing for me here is traffic and velocity. If this is a product we want to make work, we need to make the velocity happen and then let organic sales take over. Now, we said he did some giveaways and he got to the bottom of page one. In this market that's not enough. The demand is at the top of page one and it's a very top heavy market and while there's some demand at the bottom of page one it's not nearly as much as what's at the middle of page one, the top of page one. It's okay, it's five units a day based on what I'm seeing here, five/six units a day at the bottom but the top is 18 units a day or 20 units a day or 30 unit a day depending on the keyword that you search.

So we need to get velocity to get up there. Now, there's the other thing. Quan, let us know he's got 180 of them. Well if we need to get 30 units a day that gives us six days if we give them all away that would give us six days of coverage. For me I don't know that that is worth it because we would have to reorder the product, we would have to do that and then we have to hope it in time to keep the ranking. So I guess the question for you Scott is, is this something that you would write off? Is this something that you think we should try and make work? If so, how do we try and make it work? What are your thoughts on that? That's just my initial interpretation.

[00:26:02] Scott: Well, I think going back to product like selection and finding your market and again we've mentioned this recently because we've been really kind of like just going all in on product discovery and finding your market because we've been doing our new training with our class and that is product discovery boot camp where we really drill into number one, the market and then the products but then we also look at this stuff. Like if we're looking at like a market that we're going to go into and we're looking at the numbers we need to know up front that a 300 unit order isn't going to work because we need to get 300 sales in the first 15 days in order to rank.

So that's part of that criteria that we need to understand and again like I said, we go really deep in this product discovery boot camp so it would be a nice time to put a nice shameless plugin there. If you guys are struggling with it, if you guys want to go through this process and really kind of go through those checklists and really figure out the market but then also make sure that you are checking off all the right boxes, so when you do launch you don't run into a situation like this or at least you're prepared for it. So if you guys want to check that out productdiscoverybootcamp.com. Check it out, really excited about that. It's been going really, really awesome. So definitely check that out if you're interested or if you're stuck in this process.

But like right now, my thought would be this can you get rid of those units and break even right now liquidating them? Absolutely. I would have no problem saying what's my rock bottom price to just break even on this even if I buffer in a little bit like $2 a unit in pay-per-click. Maybe that is $19.95. Okay cool. Then I go ahead and I do a pay-per-click for $19.95 price point and I blow them out. Get my money back, start over, dust myself off and I start over again. Or you're like no, I think that there is potential here because there is, you need more units in order to do any type of sales velocity push, you have to do that.

[00:28:04] Scott: If that's the case then you also have to say to yourself is this something that I'm going to be building additional products in? Are the accessories to this product that lend itself to the main product and then the other product lend itself to this product, like back and forth like cross promoting. Is there three to five products in this? Me personally, I think there could be some additional products but I don't know if there's a whole market for this. I would have to do more research to say who is buying this mostly? There's got to be a certain segment of like the market that's buying this for certain purposes. I would need to figure that out and then start to position this thing for that market or that part of the market.

Then if I can do that and then build a brand in there then I would be okay moving forward but if not, then it would be easy. It would be like figure out my break even, run a little pay-per-click, basically liquidate, start over. That would be my thoughts.

[00:29:03] Chris: I think I'm on the same page there and Scott looking at this there's definitely the potential for a market. I can think of three times that this would be used and also just straight up based on the photos here. Corner is showing use cases. There's some other potential products in this market and if you can build a list in this market and it's not like he's started to and he didn't think he had enough to launch to it and if you guys are building an email list, I don't care how small it is send them an email. The worst thing that happens is you don't sell anything. It doesn't cost you anything to send that email, right?

But there's definitely a lot of other things that could be used with this product. Not necessarily directly but they speak to the same time of people's lives or this same market and it's something that if you could get some of those other things, you could definitely piggy back all those other things to launch this product and that for me Scott kind of comes back to the conversation that I was asking you about or the question that I was asking you which is like would you launch this as a first product now knowing the brand that we might be able to build in this market? The answer would be no. I wouldn't launch this as a first product. I would find something that's less competitive that appeals to the same market. Build that list, build that war chest and then come in and hit this product hard and get it to rank.

As for right now, again it depends on what you want to do. You can make this work, but you need to run the numbers. You need to know that if you double down on it or triple down on it that you are going to have enough and you are going to have a way whether that's by building up your email list or by using some of these services that your competitors are using to really get those 25/30 sales a day for 10 to 20 days. Because if you run out of those 300 units like you said Scott, you're done. So we need 300 to 400 units in this market to even make a dent in the organic rankings and get to the top of that first page.

[00:30:57] Scott: Yeah, and I think just to wrap up here the other thing that I was noticing again going through kind of like the different results that were coming back for some of those keywords and I know that you said that you think you're ranking for page one for certain keywords and that might be so but they can't be the main keywords that's driving a majority of the sales to be honest with you. Again the way that I would do that is number one I would dig through that listing of the top seller and see where there could be some keywords that they are ranking for that you're just not ranking or that you're not even targeting.

I would look at that. One way that I kind of do it and I know Chris you do, we have done it together is we use Scope which if I go on, you have to use Google Chrome. If you have that installed what you'll do is you'll go to that competitor's listing, you'll go on Scope, you'll just hit the tab, it will populate, it will show you keywords that that listing is showing up for and it will also give you through their algorithm it's nothing that's concrete but it's through their algorithm in Scope that they put together of like various keywords that are driving sales. So you can look at that and get a better idea than just guessing. I'm not saying that it is a 100% accurate but it is at least something more than just looking at it and guessing.

That there can be found at theamazingseller.com/scope or you can just go to the show notes to this episode and I'll link all that up, everything that we've talked of I'll link it up in the show notes. But I think again not to kind of keep beating it to death here but I think the product is good, I think the market is good, I think that you just have to get more sales and if you get more sales I think the rankings will come and then there's nothing to me different between yours and the one that's selling 3,800. The one that's selling 3,800 is not a major brand so that's a positive thing but it also says that they have that momentum and that velocity right now and it's going to be hard to directly compete.

[00:33:02] Scott: So that's why I would start looking at the second, third, fourth, and fifth and seeing what I can do to wiggle into one of their spots and start grabbing some of those. But again, some of those guys might be ranking right now and are not ranking three months from now because right now it's short lived and that's why you want to definitely make sure that you look at the history and see what they've been doing over time, and not just looking at the numbers that pop up first. So the other thing is though, before I do wrap up here Chris is I was looking at the listing, I would be very careful though with adding anything that is against terms of service. There's a few things there bullet wise.

I know everyone is trying to jump on, put an emoji in there, put like a star or anything like that. Be careful with that. I don't think it's necessary. It's not going to get you more sales in my opinion. If anything it could act as a red flat to Amazon and it could maybe hurt your rankings versus help you. I'm looking at the number one seller and they have some pretty standard bullets. They are not going crazy with like emojis and stuff like that. Just be careful with that. I don't think it's necessary. Then just make sure that you optimize backend keywords. Make sure that you're doing that as well.

So anything you want to wrap up with Chris before we officially sign off?

[00:34:17] Chris: No, I think the biggest lesson out of this one Scott is like I said it's not images it's not title but it is the plague of too much demand. And not launching and securing that demand appropriately I think is the issue we have here and looking at the numbers it looks like a good market to launch into. However, we need to take the upside of that demand with the downside. We need to understand that if the demand is 1,000 units on average that we need to meet that on average to rank on page one and to really secure that place. So it's going to take a little bit more effort upfront to push those things.

[00:34:53] Scott: Yeah. I don't want to discount either that Quan actually went out there and took some action and learned a ton through this process and whether this product is a success which I think it could be but even if it's not you're still a winner in the sense that you've went out there, you've done it, you've went through the entire process, you've got some good images, you've got a gold listing up, you're learning pay-per-click, you're learning that the next time you're doing your product research you're going to look at these things and again that's exactly what we talk about inside of product discovery boot camp to a T.

I mean we go right through picking the market and then looking at the products that support that market but then we also look at those numbers and we look at those initial numbers that we're going to create, like we're going to have to make those numbers happen and then that also bases on how much inventory we're going to need to start. If you're going to have 500 units sold in your first month in order to compete well you can't order 300 units. So that could make it where you put that one on the shelf and you go to the next product. So again, just things that we definitely dig into really deeply in product discovery boot camp and again that is productdisoverybootcamp.com.

Check that out if you're interested at all. I'm really excited about that training and it's one of those things that it allows us to go through the process and show you exactly what we're looking at kind of like we're doing here in an audio version. So that's it Chris. That's what I got so Quan, good luck to you. Keep us posted. Of course anyone else that's listening that is thinking to themselves, “Is this product too competitive?” This is definitely one that you probably want to go back to again or even just grab those show notes and transcripts because we went through all of those key components and those checklist items that you want to definitely make sure that you go through.

[00:36:41] Scott: All right guys, so that is going to officially wrap this up. The show notes can be found at theamazingseller.com/497 and you can grab them all there and let us know what you think. Drop a comment in the comments section in the blog or if you're listening to this on YouTube or if you're listening to this on Facebook drop us something in the comments, let us know what you think. We'd love to hear from you. All right guys, so that's it. That's going to wrap it up.

Remember as always I'm here for you, I believe in you and I am rooting for you but you have to, you have to… Come on say it with me, say it loud, say it proud, I know Chris is going to say it with me today because he is so excited about saying it and he is going to do it really, really good today. You're ready Chris?

[00:37:19] Chris: Well I now I just want to nail it in.

[00:37:23] Scott: On the count of three. One, two, three, “Take action.” Have an awesome, amazing day and I’ll see you right back here on the next episode.

[END]

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